globalisasi tidak hanya mempengaruhi pekerja kantor, juga mempengaruhi penghasilan buddhist monks (biksu? bhikkhu? atau dua2nya?) di singapura ;D
bagaimana dengan indonesia?
[spoiler]Monks face pressure of foreign competition
Income from prayer sessions down as foreign monks charge lower rate
Some monks here are feeling the heat of competition provided by their foreign counterparts.
In particular, the local monks claim that foreign monks, who are mostly from China and Malaysia, are undercutting them by charging up to 50 per cent less for prayer sessions conducted at funeral wakes.
Mr Ang Juat Chong, 59, a Singaporean who has been a Buddhist monk for the last 18 years, said his monthly income has gone down by as much as 70 per cent in the last two years because of this.
'Local monks charge about $1,200 to do Buddhist rites at funeral wakes, but these foreign monks charge only $600 or $700. So of course, funeral parlours will prefer to hire them,' he told The Straits Times yesterday.
He also suggested that some of these monks are not supposed to be chanting prayers at these wakes.
He said he knows of at least one 'monk' from Malaysia who is here on a work permit and supposed to be working as a salesman.
He added that there are real monks who are here on work permits that state they are doing religious work. But, he claimed, that permit does not allow them to be hired by funeral operators to chant prayers at wakes.
Mr Ang, who is based at a temple in Lorong 7, Geylang, said he has approached the authorities about this and also saw Hougang MP Yaw Shin Leong about it.
Mr Yaw mentioned the meeting in a Facebook post on Thursday.
Other Buddhist monks said they have also noticed an influx of foreign monks in recent years.
Reverend Ru Hong, 55, of Guat Hoon Vegetarian temple in Kembangan, estimated that more than half of all monks here are foreigners, up from about 30 per cent two or three years ago.
He, too, claimed that while some of these foreign monks are real monks at home, they are being hired out to chant at wakes here despite being on other forms of work passes or even social visit passes.
Rev Ru Hong, who has been holding prayer sessions at funerals and other ceremonies for more than 10 years, added that these monks are mostly hired to do prayers by middlemen such as undertakers.
But he added that his takings have not been affected.
Mr K.C. Low, 61, who is from a Buddhist temple in Rangoon Road, said his income has dropped by at least 30 per cent in the past five years.
'The foreign monks are cornering the market, and from what I heard, some of them are willing to do prayers for just $200 or $300,' he said.
Mr Z. Chin, 63, who took to the cloth a decade ago and is based in a Buddhist temple in Geylang, said that some months go by without him getting called to conduct a single prayer session at funeral wakes.
Three or four years ago, he would do around three sessions every month.
The influx of monks is especially high during the Seventh Month Hungry Ghost period, said the disgruntled monks.
Mr Ang estimated that at least 100 such foreign monks operate here during this period because of the higher volume of prayers and other ceremonies.
While foreign monks may offer cheaper rates, Reverend Sek noted that they may not be familiar with local customs or praying procedures.
Still, Mr Calvin Tang, 35, an undertaker with Singapore Casket, said Singaporean families normally 'won't know the difference even though the foreign monks chant in a different way from local ones'.
Rev Ru Hong said local Buddhist monks go through a head-shaving ceremony witnessed by three senior monks in a monastery.
They also have a booklet that certifies that they have learnt all the rules and procedures and have vowed to abide by them, and this booklet is given out by temples.[/spoiler]
wah kok malah memperjual belikan doa ya :o
para bhiksu kok jadi berat ke materi, begini yang membuat pandangan salah terhadap para bhiksu yang kena efeknya bhikku yang baik juga ...
Waduh, banyak bhiksu professional ya di sin cia po :|
kalau biksu mahayana diperbolehkan memegang uang atau barang selain 4 kebutuhan pokok ya??
money, money, money :)
Quote from: morpheus on 21 November 2011, 03:29:22 PM
globalisasi tidak hanya mempengaruhi pekerja kantor, juga mempengaruhi penghasilan buddhist monks (biksu? bhikkhu? atau dua2nya?) di singapura ;D
bagaimana dengan indonesia?
[spoiler]Monks face pressure of foreign competition
Income from prayer sessions down as foreign monks charge lower rate
Some monks here are feeling the heat of competition provided by their foreign counterparts.
In particular, the local monks claim that foreign monks, who are mostly from China and Malaysia, are undercutting them by charging up to 50 per cent less for prayer sessions conducted at funeral wakes.
Mr Ang Juat Chong, 59, a Singaporean who has been a Buddhist monk for the last 18 years, said his monthly income has gone down by as much as 70 per cent in the last two years because of this.
'Local monks charge about $1,200 to do Buddhist rites at funeral wakes, but these foreign monks charge only $600 or $700. So of course, funeral parlours will prefer to hire them,' he told The Straits Times yesterday.
He also suggested that some of these monks are not supposed to be chanting prayers at these wakes.
He said he knows of at least one 'monk' from Malaysia who is here on a work permit and supposed to be working as a salesman.
He added that there are real monks who are here on work permits that state they are doing religious work. But, he claimed, that permit does not allow them to be hired by funeral operators to chant prayers at wakes.
Mr Ang, who is based at a temple in Lorong 7, Geylang, said he has approached the authorities about this and also saw Hougang MP Yaw Shin Leong about it.
Mr Yaw mentioned the meeting in a Facebook post on Thursday.
Other Buddhist monks said they have also noticed an influx of foreign monks in recent years.
Reverend Ru Hong, 55, of Guat Hoon Vegetarian temple in Kembangan, estimated that more than half of all monks here are foreigners, up from about 30 per cent two or three years ago.
He, too, claimed that while some of these foreign monks are real monks at home, they are being hired out to chant at wakes here despite being on other forms of work passes or even social visit passes.
Rev Ru Hong, who has been holding prayer sessions at funerals and other ceremonies for more than 10 years, added that these monks are mostly hired to do prayers by middlemen such as undertakers.
But he added that his takings have not been affected.
Mr K.C. Low, 61, who is from a Buddhist temple in Rangoon Road, said his income has dropped by at least 30 per cent in the past five years.
'The foreign monks are cornering the market, and from what I heard, some of them are willing to do prayers for just $200 or $300,' he said.
Mr Z. Chin, 63, who took to the cloth a decade ago and is based in a Buddhist temple in Geylang, said that some months go by without him getting called to conduct a single prayer session at funeral wakes.
Three or four years ago, he would do around three sessions every month.
The influx of monks is especially high during the Seventh Month Hungry Ghost period, said the disgruntled monks.
Mr Ang estimated that at least 100 such foreign monks operate here during this period because of the higher volume of prayers and other ceremonies.
While foreign monks may offer cheaper rates, Reverend Sek noted that they may not be familiar with local customs or praying procedures.
Still, Mr Calvin Tang, 35, an undertaker with Singapore Casket, said Singaporean families normally 'won't know the difference even though the foreign monks chant in a different way from local ones'.
Rev Ru Hong said local Buddhist monks go through a head-shaving ceremony witnessed by three senior monks in a monastery.
They also have a booklet that certifies that they have learnt all the rules and procedures and have vowed to abide by them, and this booklet is given out by temples.[/spoiler]
No wonder umat Buddha di Singapore merosot dari sekitar 42.5% (sensus thn 2000) menjd hanya sekitar 33% (sensus thn 2010) Sekalipun Buddhism masih merupakan agama terbanyak penganutnya di sana, umat kr****n, org tak beragama dan umat taoism yg meningkat jumlahnya (sensus thn 2010).
Ternyata banyak 'biksu' di Singapore yg memasang tarif :o :o :o :o :o
Mudah2an masih ada bikkhu/biksu yg masih memegang vinaya........
ini juga yg jd alesan dhamma merosot di negara2 maju seperti jepang/korea/singapure karena bhikkhu disana cm sebatas profesi/penguasaan dan pemahaman dhamma kurang, jd bs dikatakan ajaran dan nilai buddhist sudah sangat merosot/luntur, buddhist cm dianggap sebagai agama budaya...
cilaka nya hal ini yg digunakan oleh para evangelish untuk masuk... tragis... tragis...
kacian... kacian... kacian...
bhikkhu/brahmana/petapa yg berkelakuan benar tidak khawatir dgn keadaan/situasi apapun _/\_
Quote from: will_i_am on 21 November 2011, 04:36:57 PM
kalau biksu mahayana diperbolehkan memegang uang atau barang selain 4 kebutuhan pokok ya??
ga ada yang jawab nih??
lbh baik kalau sdh pakai jubah, khusus-nya bhikkhu, alangkah baiknya bertempat tinggal ditempat yang sepi dan jauh dari lokasi duniawi
kalau bhiksu, ane kaga ikut campur, urusan vinaya masing2....
Quote from: will_i_am on 21 November 2011, 07:48:04 PM
ga ada yang jawab nih??
mungkin bisa dicari dibutir kedisiplan aliran tsb...
semoga bukan katanya si Anu...
Quote from: Mas Tidar on 21 November 2011, 09:04:01 PM
mungkin bisa dicari dibutir kedisiplan aliran tsb...
semoga bukan katanya si Anu...
ane mau cari dimana?? :'( :'(
justru mau nanya langsung ke para penganut mahayana disini...
Setahu saya, aturan bagi bhiksu Mahayana yg menggunakan Vinaya aliran Dharmaguptaka (yg merupakan pecahan aliran Sthraviravada/Theravada) mirip jg dg Vinaya Theravada, sama2 tdk boleh menggunakan uang. Cmiiw....
Quote from: will_i_am on 21 November 2011, 04:36:57 PM
kalau biksu mahayana diperbolehkan memegang uang atau barang selain 4 kebutuhan pokok ya??
beberapa ribu tahun yang dulu mungkin masih praktek Vinaya dgn baik.
jaman sekarang udah canggih, yang penting tidak melanggar parajika.
tapi diyakini yang sekarang juga masih ada yang benar praktek Vinaya dengan baik. :)
Ya masalah menerima dan memegang uang dsb itu bukan masalah upaya kausalya, bukan masalah pembenaran di zaman modern, tetapi lebih karena mereka memegang satu KODE SET aturan yang BERBEDA atau VINAYA yang BERBEDA.
1. Mahasanghika Vinaya membolehkan para bhiksu menerima uang tapi tidka boleh menyentuhnya, jadi mereka memakai semacam pelindung tangan untuk tidak menyentuh uang secara langsung.
2. Mulasarvastivada Vinaya membolehkan para bhiksu menerima uang dan melakukan berbagai transaksi ekonomi serta kegiatan komersial lainnya. Dalam Vinaya tersebut dicatat bahwa Sang Buddha Shakyamuni sendiri yang memberikan berbagai macam saran bagaimana cara meng-handle uang secara bijaksana oleh para anggota Sangha.
Anggota Sangha Tibetan dan Shingon Jepang mengikuti Vinaya Mulasarvastivada. Anggota Sangha Mahayana Tiongkok dan Jepang yang lain mengikuti Dharmaguptaka Vinaya.
Dharmaguptaka Vinaya (Four Parts Vinaya) melarang menerima dan memegang uang seperti layaknya Theravada. Namun di era modern ini tampaknya para bhiksu Mahayana Tiongkok juga mengikuti satu kode etik yang disarankan Mulasarvastivada Vinaya ttg uang.
Jadi kalau ada kejadian kaya bhiksu menerima uang tidak usah dipolemikkan. A mengikuti Vinaya A. B mengikuti Vinaya B. Dan beres. 8)
Yang perlu dipolemikkan adalah, apakah cara meng-handle uang yang dilakukan Sangha bertentangan denagn cara bijaksana yang dianjurkan di dalam Vinaya? Dari kasus di atas, bisa dilihat mereka malah terikat dengan uang itu sendiri, mencari untung semata bagi pribadi (dilihat dari mematok tarif tinggi-tinggi), menjadikan semacam saingan bisnis bhiksu lain, ini yang tidak pernah dianjurkan Vinaya manapun.
_/\_
The Siddha Wanderer
Quote from: GandalfTheElder on 22 November 2011, 06:20:09 AM
Ya masalah menerima dan memegang uang dsb itu bukan masalah upaya kausalya, bukan masalah pembenaran di zaman modern, tetapi lebih karena mereka memegang satu KODE SET aturan yang BERBEDA atau VINAYA yang BERBEDA.
1. Mahasanghika Vinaya membolehkan para bhiksu menerima uang tapi tidka boleh menyentuhnya, jadi mereka memakai semacam pelindung tangan untuk tidak menyentuh uang secara langsung.
2. Mulasarvastivada Vinaya membolehkan para bhiksu menerima uang dan melakukan berbagai transaksi ekonomi serta kegiatan komersial lainnya. Dalam Vinaya tersebut dicatat bahwa Sang Buddha Shakyamuni sendiri yang memberikan berbagai macam saran bagaimana cara meng-handle uang secara bijaksana oleh para anggota Sangha.
Anggota Sangha Tibetan dan Shingon Jepang mengikuti Vinaya Mulasarvastivada. Anggota Sangha Mahayana Tiongkok dan Jepang yang lain mengikuti Dharmaguptaka Vinaya.
Dharmaguptaka Vinaya (Four Parts Vinaya) melarang menerima dan memegang uang seperti layaknya Theravada. Namun di era modern ini tampaknya para bhiksu Mahayana Tiongkok juga mengikuti satu kode etik yang disarankan Mulasarvastivada Vinaya ttg uang.
Jadi kalau ada kejadian kaya bhiksu menerima uang tidak usah dipolemikkan. A mengikuti Vinaya A. B mengikuti Vinaya B. Dan beres. 8)
Yang perlu dipolemikkan adalah, apakah cara meng-handle uang yang dilakukan Sangha bertentangan denagn cara bijaksana yang dianjurkan di dalam Vinaya? Dari kasus di atas, bisa dilihat mereka malah terikat dengan uang itu sendiri, mencari untung semata bagi pribadi (dilihat dari mematok tarif tinggi-tinggi), menjadikan semacam saingan bisnis bhiksu lain, ini yang tidak pernah dianjurkan Vinaya manapun.
_/\_
The Siddha Wanderer
terus yang mana seharusnya vinaya "turunan" buddha Gautama ?
So, it's all about money, money and money 8)
[at] Gandalf, numpang tanya, Mahayana yg di Indonesia ini (SMI or SAGIN) mengadopsi vinaya yg mana ya?
[at] Indra
Harusnya Dharmaguptaka... tp karena semangat Mahayana itu non-sektarian terhadap 18 aliran Shravakayana, maka kemungkinan juga mengambil poin" dr Mulasarvastivada Vinaya.
Quoteterus yang mana seharusnya vinaya "turunan" buddha Gautama ?
Masing" mengaku paling asli.
_/\_
The Siddha Wanderer
Quote from: GandalfTheElder on 22 November 2011, 11:06:11 PM
[at] Indra
Harusnya Dharmaguptaka... tp karena semangat Mahayana itu non-sektarian terhadap 18 aliran Shravakayana, maka kemungkinan juga mengambil poin" dr Mulasarvastivada Vinaya.
_/\_
The Siddha Wanderer
maksudnya, gabungin semua then pilih hanya vinaya yg menunjang kenikmatan duniawi, misalnya memperkaya diri, makan malam, dll?
Quote from: GandalfTheElder on 22 November 2011, 11:06:11 PM
Quote from: dilbert on 22 November 2011, 10:25:59 AM
terus yang mana seharusnya vinaya "turunan" buddha Gautama ?
Masing" mengaku paling asli.
_/\_
The Siddha Wanderer
masing-masing yang beda itu ngaku paling asli.... =))
Kmrn saya bertanya kpd seorg suhu (bhiksu Mahayana) tentang kasus penggunaan uang oleh anggota Sangha. Kata beliau, bhiksu tidak seharusnya mencari nafkah/uang, pd berita itu adalah mrk yg menjadi bhiksu untuk menjadikannya sbg mata pencaharian, jelas praktek yg salah/menyimpang dari Buddha Dharma.
Quote from: seniya on 23 November 2011, 08:30:23 PM
Kmrn saya bertanya kpd seorg suhu (bhiksu Mahayana) tentang kasus penggunaan uang oleh anggota Sangha. Kata beliau, bhiksu tidak seharusnya mencari nafkah/uang, pd berita itu adalah mrk yg menjadi bhiksu untuk menjadikannya sbg mata pencaharian, jelas praktek yg salah/menyimpang dari Buddha Dharma.
ini suhu/bhiksu yg benar :jempol: