//honeypot demagogic

 Forum DhammaCitta. Forum Diskusi Buddhis Indonesia

Author Topic: Adakah Atman dalam Agama Buddha ?  (Read 96931 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline ryu

  • Global Moderator
  • KalyanaMitta
  • *****
  • Posts: 13.403
  • Reputasi: 429
  • Gender: Male
  • hampir mencapai penggelapan sempurna ;D
Re: Ada Atman dalam Agama Buddha
« Reply #15 on: 27 September 2010, 10:21:54 AM »
peraturan cult :
1. saya tidak pernah salah
2. kalau saya salah, lihat aturan 1
Janganlah memperhatikan kesalahan dan hal-hal yang telah atau belum dikerjakan oleh diri sendiri. Tetapi, perhatikanlah apa yang telah dikerjakan dan apa yang belum dikerjakan oleh orang lain =))

Offline Nevada

  • Sebelumnya: Upasaka
  • KalyanaMitta
  • *****
  • Posts: 6.445
  • Reputasi: 234
Re: Ada Atman dalam Agama Buddha
« Reply #16 on: 27 September 2010, 10:23:26 AM »
peraturan cult :
1. saya tidak pernah salah
2. kalau saya salah, lihat aturan 1

1. Siapa "cult" yang dimaksud?
2. Siapa "saya" yang dimaksud?

Offline ryu

  • Global Moderator
  • KalyanaMitta
  • *****
  • Posts: 13.403
  • Reputasi: 429
  • Gender: Male
  • hampir mencapai penggelapan sempurna ;D
Re: Ada Atman dalam Agama Buddha
« Reply #17 on: 27 September 2010, 10:25:45 AM »
peraturan cult :
1. saya tidak pernah salah
2. kalau saya salah, lihat aturan 1

1. Siapa "cult" yang dimaksud?
2. Siapa "saya" yang dimaksud?
kaga tau :whistle:
Janganlah memperhatikan kesalahan dan hal-hal yang telah atau belum dikerjakan oleh diri sendiri. Tetapi, perhatikanlah apa yang telah dikerjakan dan apa yang belum dikerjakan oleh orang lain =))

Offline xenocross

  • KalyanaMitta
  • *****
  • Posts: 1.189
  • Reputasi: 61
  • Gender: Male
Re: Ada Atman dalam Agama Buddha
« Reply #18 on: 27 September 2010, 10:30:17 AM »
jadi kalau Sutra-sutra sudah bilang gak ada Atman, dan sesepuh ke-6 Zen juga bilang begitu....

Ngapain ngikutin master Zen yang ke-sekian? OK?
Satu saat dari pikiran yang dikuasai amarah membakar kebaikan yang telah dikumpulkan selama berkalpa-kalpa.
~ Mahavairocana Sutra

Offline coecoed

  • Sahabat
  • ***
  • Posts: 196
  • Reputasi: -6
  • Semoga semua mahluk berbahagia
Re: Ada Atman dalam Agama Buddha
« Reply #19 on: 27 September 2010, 11:24:32 AM »
trikaya...
Dhammakaya
Sambhoga kaya
Nimannakaya

Spirit
Soul
Body

tetapi
semua yang dibicarakan manusia dunia (samsara) tentang spirit atau Dhammakaya, itu adalah hanya sebatas soul dan body. itu disebabkan karena masih belum terbebaskan dari atau masih tercekatnya kepada konsep kewujudan (karena kepada kemelekatan) yang dunawi (moha dan lobha).
umat berbicara tentang keBuddhaan, sesungguhnya mereka membicarakan kewujudan mereka.
bahkan kesunyaan yang dimaksud guru Buddha, dimaknai umat sebagai kosong dalam faham konsep kewujudan mereka meskipun secara teori mereka berteori berdebat-debat seolah-olah mereka mengenali tentang kebenaran yang guru Buddha maksud.
seperti juga penjelasan pada isi sutra diatas, bahwa guru Buddha membukakan kebenaran bahwa Ia mengajarkan konsep-konsep jalan umum kepada awam/murid-murid umum untuk supaya awam/murid  dapat membebaskan dari konsep kewujudan duniawi sehingga boleh dapat mengenali (keberadaan) yang sejati (the Truth). Tetapi bukan mengenali, malah-malah mereka terjebak kepada pandangan yang berasal dari ikatan kepada konsep kewujudan (karena kepada kemelekatan) yang dunawi diri mereka sendiri.
Itulah guru Buddha memberikan pengajaran jalan umum kepada awam, agar murid/umat dapat memisahkan yang duniawi, membedakan dan lalu sehingga mengenali kebenaran (keberadaan) yang sejati. sehingga dapat memaknai dengan benar meskipun belum merealisasi pembebasannya tentang tujuan kehidupan/pencapaian Nibanna (keberadaan kehidupan guru Buddha/mereka yang tercerahkan).
Itulah sehingga ada sebutan pengajaran jalan mulia (Mahayana) dan jalan umum. Tetapi kenyataan lagi adalah ada ajaran yang seolah-olah turunan mahayana tetapi terjebak lagi kepada takhayul yang melekat sesungguhnya kepada yang bersifat duniawi bukan jalan pembebasan seperti guru Buddha ajarkan yang sesungguhnya, karena kesalah pengenalan kebenaran dari ajaran mulia tersebut dari para murid/umatNya karena mereka terperangkap memaknai dalam kekhayalan manusia duniawi mereka sendiri juga (moha/kegelapan), dalam praktek keyakinan jalan pembebasan mereka bergantung kepada makhluk-makhluk aneh samsara, yang dimaksud guru Buddha tidak ada Tuhan 'dunia' yang dapat menyelamatkan. yang dimaknai salah juga oleh umat jalan umum sebagai tiada sumber kehidupan asaliah, melainkan semua hanya sebatas ukuran keberadaan duniawiah oleh karena terperangkap oleh konsep salah mereka sendiri (kebingungan atau kekacauan memaknai istilah kosong kekosongan yang mereka terjemahkan sendiri dari karena konsep (dari karena kemelkatan) kewujudan duniawi mereka sendiri).


nah omong-omong..klo penjelasan saya siapa yah sahabat umat yang ada dapat mengerti tulisan saya ini...? boro-boro mencerap, malah-malah menimbulkkan penolakan yang berasal dari ego keakuan (membangkitkan ego).

Itu saja saya hanya membicarakan, membagi kebenaran yang diajarkan oleh guru Buddha, apalagi klo saya membicarakan tentang Tuhan, the Almighty God. (Allah Bapa (Ex 3:14  And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you),    (Joh 10:9  I am the door: by me if any man enter in, he shall be saved, and shall go in and out, and find pasture. Joh 14:6   saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me) dan (diinsyafi) Roh kudus ( 26  But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you).
oleh karena ketidak-mengenalan sehingga seperti juga contoh ada umat yang memaknai malaikat Jibril dibilang sebagai Roh Kudus, padahal seperti yang sudah pernah saya jelaskan bahwa semua sudah ada tatanan, bahwa malaikat adlah sebagai malaikat fungsinya bukan lain.


sahabat buddhist
coecoed, the believer

« Last Edit: 27 September 2010, 11:42:07 AM by coecoed »
INILAH APA YANG TUHANKU TELAH KATAKAN, 'DALAM SATU TAHUN SEJAK HARI INI, KEJAYAAN MEREKA AKAN PUDAR'.


September 2010
coedabgf-the believer

Offline xenocross

  • KalyanaMitta
  • *****
  • Posts: 1.189
  • Reputasi: 61
  • Gender: Male
Re: Ada Atman dalam Agama Buddha
« Reply #20 on: 27 September 2010, 11:24:37 AM »
hikssss
hikssssssssssss
anda membuat saya buka ebook yang njelimet dan bikin pusing
Tanggung jawab!

Introduction to the Middle Way
Chandrakirti’s Madhyamakavatara
With commentary by Dzongsar Jamyang Khyentse Rinpoche
Given at the Centre d’Etudes de Chanteloube
Dordogne, France
1996, 1998, 1999, 2000
Arranged according to Gorampa’s commentary
Edited by Alex Trisoglio
© 2003 by Khyentse Foundation


(a) Autogenesis (Self-Arising)
Here our symbolic opponents are the Samkhya school, which was founded by Kapila, who is
thought to have lived in the 7th century BC. It advocates a quite complicated dualistic vision of
the universe, starting with the old question, what is the universe made of. It leads on to questions
about the true self or, more accurately, telling the true self from that which appears to be self.
According to the Samkhyas, there are two basic categories in the universe: purusha and prakriti.
They say that the history of the world is the history of these two fundamental constituents, which
is quite different from Upanishad thought. From this simple dualism develops a very complex
set of interrelations between purusha, which is like the spirit of atman, and prakriti, which is like
the matter of original nature. The nature of purusha is spirit; it is many spirits. It is being,
consciousness. It is limitless, untainted awareness.

The Samkhyas argue that the world is formed as purusha infuses prakriti, and thereby stimulates
the three states of prakriti, which are called the three gunas. These are activity (rajas in
Sanskrit), inactivity (tamas) and transparency (sattva). This is a very interesting theory – it is the
highest Hindu philosophy. If you are not careful when explaining the Buddha nature, you might
end up talking about something more like purusha.

(hal 89)

The Samkhyas are saying that cause and effect have one essence, and that the cause contains the
result. In the ninth chapter of the Bodhicharyavatara, Shantideva negates this argument, saying
that in this case, when you eat rice, you must be eating shit (9:135.3-4). You might argue that
there is a potential of shit there, and that this is what you are eating. But because the Samkhyas
believe in things being truly existent, they cannot use the word ‘potential’. They believe that
purusha is truly existent, that prakriti is the wealth of the purusha, and that purusha enjoys the
prakriti. Purusha, the atman, is truly and permanent existent, so they cannot even dream of
talking about potential. Words like ‘potential’ belong to the dependent arising school, people
like us.
(hal 91)

Many buddhists used to be tirthikas, meaning that they come from a religious background that
believes in things like an atman, a creator and so on. Actually, this includes all of us. We do not
necessarily come from a religious background like that, but we all like to believe that there is
something inside us. For people like this, it is too much to directly give a teaching of certain or
ultimate meaning, such as all is emptiness. So, the Buddha first taught them something that
resembles their atman or soul, and he refers to it as the alaya, individual or aggregates.


6:44 Although free from the view of transitory collection,
The Buddha still would say “I” and “my teaching”.
Likewise, while things have no inherent nature,
In the context of expedient truth, he spoke of a [relative] existence.


Sloka 44 says this further. Although the Buddha himself is free from all kinds of transitory collections like form, feeling, karma and so on, when he addresses his disciples, he says things like “I”, “I reached enlightenment in Bodh Gaya”, or “I was once upon a time a bird”. [Note: a view of transition collection, Tib. ’jig tshog gi lta ba, is a view that hold a collection of entities as a solid entity]. He also talks about “my” father and “my” mother, because it is necessary for the sake of communication. Likewise, although things do not have any inherently existent nature, for the sake of communication, he teaches that certain things exist, and those are teachings of expedient or provisional meaning.

In the autocommentary there are a few wonderful verses coming from the Theravada sutras, which I will quickly go through. They offer praise to the Buddha and at the same time give an explanation about teachings that have provisional meaning.

If the buddhas do not act according to ordinary people’s acceptance, then ordinary people will never have a chance to understand who is the Buddha and what is the teaching that he taught.
(hal 154)

Satu saat dari pikiran yang dikuasai amarah membakar kebaikan yang telah dikumpulkan selama berkalpa-kalpa.
~ Mahavairocana Sutra

Offline Indra

  • Global Moderator
  • KalyanaMitta
  • *****
  • Posts: 14.819
  • Reputasi: 451
  • Gender: Male
Re: Ada Atman dalam Agama Buddha
« Reply #21 on: 27 September 2010, 11:26:39 AM »
itu disebabkan karena masih belum terbebaskan dari atau masih tercekatnya kepada konsep kewujudan (karena kepada kemelekatan) yang dunawi.


mulai deh...

Offline xenocross

  • KalyanaMitta
  • *****
  • Posts: 1.189
  • Reputasi: 61
  • Gender: Male
Re: Ada Atman dalam Agama Buddha
« Reply #22 on: 27 September 2010, 11:33:41 AM »
[Q]: If everything arises from the mind, then are all outer objects also mind?
[A]: Yes, but mind is a truly existent entity and everything comes from that, which is why it
becomes other-arising. This is different from atman. The difference between the
Cittamatrins and the tirthikas is that the Cittamatrins say that zhenwong, or dependent
nature, is truly existent. Things that are produced, küntak, are only labelling. They do not
exist, which is why it becomes other-arising, whereas when the tirthikas talk about the self,
they talk about twenty-five different kinds of qualities of the self that are also existent.
They do not say that these are just labelling, which is why their theory becomes self-arising.
(hal 195)

Now we come to the third line of sloka 95, the one that I was saying it is important to discuss. In the Lankavatara Sutra, when the Buddha taught buddha nature, he described the buddha nature as having all the enlightened qualities right from the beginning as its ultimate nature, as the ultimate nature. He also taught things like the buddha nature, with its 32 major marks and 80 minor marks; all these exist here this very moment. This is also taught in the West, because many people like to hear things like basic goodness of human beings and all that. Now, the commentary is saying that these teachings have provisional meaning, which could be a bit shocking, especially if you do not know the philosophy very much. But if you know it, it is not shocking.

The Buddha further explained that the buddha nature has all the qualities of the buddha, like the most precious jewel. But right now, temporally, it is wrapped by all kinds of emotion. It is like a precious jewel that is wrapped in all kinds of dirty clothes, dust and all that. Then a disciple asked the Buddha, “in this case, what is the difference between you talking about this buddha nature, and the tirthikas talking about a truly existent atman, gods, almighty creators and all of that. What is the difference? They are exactly the same”. The Buddha replied to this bodhisattva that this buddha nature is definitely not the same as truly existent god, atman or any of the others. He further explained that the name Buddha nature is given to this nature of neverarising, never-ceasing, non-duality.
The Buddha said that this emptiness, this very shunyata, is sometimes given a different name and referred to as Buddha nature. These are still all the Buddha’s words. He said that, “I did this because there are certain sentient beings who fear losing the self”. This is very much like us; for example, we become very afraid when we talk about selflessness. For those sentient beings that have a great fear of losing the self or the ego, in order for them to eventually understand the great shunyata, he then used the word buddha nature, tathagatagarbha, as a substitute name for emptiness. In this way, even treatises like Lord Maitreya’s Uttaratantra are actually only shastras of provisional meaning, whether you like it or not. There it is!
(hal 204)
« Last Edit: 27 September 2010, 11:36:14 AM by xenocross »
Satu saat dari pikiran yang dikuasai amarah membakar kebaikan yang telah dikumpulkan selama berkalpa-kalpa.
~ Mahavairocana Sutra

Offline adi lim

  • Sebelumnya: adiharto
  • KalyanaMitta
  • *****
  • Posts: 4.993
  • Reputasi: 108
  • Gender: Male
  • Sabbe Satta Bhavantu Sukhitatta
Re: Ada Atman dalam Agama Buddha
« Reply #23 on: 27 September 2010, 11:36:10 AM »

nah omong-omong..klo penjelasan saya siapa yah sahabat umat yang ada dapat mengerti tulisan saya ini...? boro-boro mencerap, malah-malah menimbulkkan penolakan yang berasal dari ego keakuan (membangkitkan ego).

Itu saja saya hanya membicarakan, membagi kebenaran yang diajarkan oleh guru Buddha, apalagi klo saya membicarakan tentang Tuhan, the Almighty God. (Allah Bapa (Ex 3:14  And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said,
Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you),   (Joh 10:9  I am the door: by me if any man enter in, he shall be saved, and shall go in and out, and find pasture. Joh 14:6   saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me) dan (diinsyafi) Roh kudus ( 26  But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you).

sahabat buddhist
coecoed, the believer


kalau membicarakan tentang Tuhan lebih tidak mengerti lagi
lebih baik jangan bahas lagi, bikin energi bro cucud  terbuang sia2.  =)) =))

 _/\_

« Last Edit: 27 September 2010, 11:41:01 AM by adi lim »
Seringlah PancaKhanda direnungkan sebagai Ini Bukan MILIKKU, Ini Bukan AKU, Ini Bukan DIRIKU, bermanfaat mengurangi keSERAKAHan, mengurangi keSOMBONGan, Semoga dapat menjauhi Pandangan SALAH.

Offline hendrako

  • KalyanaMitta
  • *****
  • Posts: 1.244
  • Reputasi: 60
  • Gender: Male
Re: Ada Atman dalam Agama Buddha
« Reply #24 on: 27 September 2010, 11:38:49 AM »

nah omong-omong..klo penjelasan saya siapa yah sahabat umat yang ada dapat mengerti tulisan saya ini...? boro-boro mencerap, malah-malah menimbulkkan penolakan yang berasal dari ego keakuan (membangkitkan ego).

sahabat buddhist
coecoed, the believer


Kalo mencerap tulisan anda, apakah itu berarti tidak berasal dari ego keakuan yah bro? (menidurkan ego??)
yaa... gitu deh

Offline xenocross

  • KalyanaMitta
  • *****
  • Posts: 1.189
  • Reputasi: 61
  • Gender: Male
Re: Ada Atman dalam Agama Buddha
« Reply #25 on: 27 September 2010, 11:41:49 AM »


Itu saja saya hanya membicarakan, membagi kebenaran yang diajarkan oleh guru Buddha, apalagi klo saya membicarakan tentang Tuhan, the Almighty God. (Allah Bapa (Ex 3:14  And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you),   (Joh 10:9  I am the door: by me if any man enter in, he shall be saved, and shall go in and out, and find pasture. Joh 14:6   saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me) dan (diinsyafi) Roh kudus ( 26  But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you).


sahabat buddhist
coecoed, the believer

masih dari buku yang sama.....

So, many of these Vedic religions believe that God is truly existent. It is independent from causes and conditions; human beings do not fabricate it. It is not a fake; it is there all the time. And the rest is all maya, or illusion. This is what they believe.

I think that Christianity, Islam and Judaism must also talk about truth and non-truth, although they may not use this language. We can debate this, but I think that there must be a right and wrong way of doing things – ethics. Why is going to church every Sunday the right way? There must be a view, and as we go on, they will say things like it is because God is the only merciful one, and so on. If we ask why killing is bad, they will have another answer: because it is against this and against that. The distinction between truth and non-truth is always there. In other words, they are establishing a truly existent phenomenon.

The Vaibhashika school in buddhism has extensively defeated the idea or notion of God, and shown that it is a fabrication of whatever the religion. For the Vaibhashikas, only two smallest things exist: a very small thing like an atom, and a very small particle of mind. This is why we call them Vaibhashika, which means ‘proponent of discrete entities’ (bye brag smra ba). The Sautrantika view is very similar, although there are some differences. The Cittamatra school has extensively defeated these ideas of the Vaibhashikas and Sautrantikas, and they conclude that only mind is truly existent. Everything else is just an illusion, made in Thailand. Mind is the only one that is genuine leather.

But Chandrakirti does not believe in genuine leather. Well, he believes in genuine leather, but not in truly existent genuine leather. He thinks that if it exists, then it has to have a birth. And if it is truly existent, then it has to come from self, other, both or neither. Since he will refute all of these possibilities when he examines them, he concludes that it cannot exist. So, if you ask him, well in that case what would you accept, he would say, “dependent arising”. Without genuine leather, there is no imitation leather. Without imitation leather, there is no genuine leather. Genuine is dependent on imitation, and imitation is dependent on genuine. This is his philosophy, so for him there is no such thing as a real cause.
Satu saat dari pikiran yang dikuasai amarah membakar kebaikan yang telah dikumpulkan selama berkalpa-kalpa.
~ Mahavairocana Sutra

Offline coecoed

  • Sahabat
  • ***
  • Posts: 196
  • Reputasi: -6
  • Semoga semua mahluk berbahagia
Re: Ada Atman dalam Agama Buddha
« Reply #26 on: 27 September 2010, 11:50:35 AM »
itu disebabkan karena masih belum terbebaskan dari atau masih tercekatnya kepada konsep kewujudan (karena kepada kemelekatan) yang dunawi.


mulai deh...


yah sudah..., saya artikan sendiri dah bro....
= seolah-olah tercengkram sangat kuat oleh fihak lain, padahal diri sendiri yang mencengkram atau menggenggam atau melekatinya sangat kuat.


semoga membantu membaca tulisanku yang bermutu
coeda-the believer
INILAH APA YANG TUHANKU TELAH KATAKAN, 'DALAM SATU TAHUN SEJAK HARI INI, KEJAYAAN MEREKA AKAN PUDAR'.


September 2010
coedabgf-the believer

Offline coecoed

  • Sahabat
  • ***
  • Posts: 196
  • Reputasi: -6
  • Semoga semua mahluk berbahagia
Re: Ada Atman dalam Agama Buddha
« Reply #27 on: 27 September 2010, 11:57:35 AM »


Itu saja saya hanya membicarakan, membagi kebenaran yang diajarkan oleh guru Buddha, apalagi klo saya membicarakan tentang Tuhan, the Almighty God. (Allah Bapa (Ex 3:14  And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you),   (Joh 10:9  I am the door: by me if any man enter in, he shall be saved, and shall go in and out, and find pasture. Joh 14:6   saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me) dan (diinsyafi) Roh kudus ( 26  But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you).


sahabat buddhist
coecoed, the believer

masih dari buku yang sama.....

So, many of these Vedic religions believe that God is truly existent. It is independent from causes and conditions; human beings do not fabricate it. It is not a fake; it is there all the time. And the rest is all maya, or illusion. This is what they believe.

I think that Christianity, Islam and Judaism must also talk about truth and non-truth, although they may not use this language. We can debate this, but I think that there must be a right and wrong way of doing things – ethics. Why is going to church every Sunday the right way? There must be a view, and as we go on, they will say things like it is because God is the only merciful one, and so on. If we ask why killing is bad, they will have another answer: because it is against this and against that. The distinction between truth and non-truth is always there. In other words, they are establishing a truly existent phenomenon.

The Vaibhashika school in buddhism has extensively defeated the idea or notion of God, and shown that it is a fabrication of whatever the religion. For the Vaibhashikas, only two smallest things exist: a very small thing like an atom, and a very small particle of mind. This is why we call them Vaibhashika, which means ‘proponent of discrete entities’ (bye brag smra ba). The Sautrantika view is very similar, although there are some differences. The Cittamatra school has extensively defeated these ideas of the Vaibhashikas and Sautrantikas, and they conclude that only mind is truly existent. Everything else is just an illusion, made in Thailand. Mind is the only one that is genuine leather.

But Chandrakirti does not believe in genuine leather. Well, he believes in genuine leather, but not in truly existent genuine leather. He thinks that if it exists, then it has to have a birth. And if it is truly existent, then it has to come from self, other, both or neither. Since he will refute all of these possibilities when he examines them, he concludes that it cannot exist. So, if you ask him, well in that case what would you accept, he would say, “dependent arising”. Without genuine leather, there is no imitation leather. Without imitation leather, there is no genuine leather. Genuine is dependent on imitation, and imitation is dependent on genuine. This is his philosophy, so for him there is no such thing as a real cause.

i think... i think, better prove lah (ehi passiko)..... not ' i think... i think', so you would know the Truth, not your thinking. Like your thinking about the truth of Buddha teaching. ;D

sahabatmu
coeda-the believer
INILAH APA YANG TUHANKU TELAH KATAKAN, 'DALAM SATU TAHUN SEJAK HARI INI, KEJAYAAN MEREKA AKAN PUDAR'.


September 2010
coedabgf-the believer

Offline Indra

  • Global Moderator
  • KalyanaMitta
  • *****
  • Posts: 14.819
  • Reputasi: 451
  • Gender: Male
Re: Ada Atman dalam Agama Buddha
« Reply #28 on: 27 September 2010, 11:59:27 AM »
itu disebabkan karena masih belum terbebaskan dari atau masih tercekatnya kepada konsep kewujudan (karena kepada kemelekatan) yang dunawi.


mulai deh...


yah sudah..., saya artikan sendiri dah bro....
= seolah-olah tercengkram sangat kuat oleh fihak lain, padahal diri sendiri yang mencengkram atau menggenggam atau melekatinya sangat kuat.


semoga membantu membaca tulisanku yang bermutu
coeda-the believer

coba amati batin sendiri, apakah itu terjadi pada anda atau tidak

Offline coecoed

  • Sahabat
  • ***
  • Posts: 196
  • Reputasi: -6
  • Semoga semua mahluk berbahagia
Re: Ada Atman dalam Agama Buddha
« Reply #29 on: 27 September 2010, 12:04:50 PM »
trikaya...
Dhammakaya
Sambhoga kaya
Nimannakaya

Spirit
Soul
Body

tetapi
semua yang dibicarakan manusia dunia (samsara) tentang spirit atau Dhammakaya, itu adalah hanya sebatas soul dan body. itu disebabkan karena masih belum terbebaskan dari atau masih tercekatnya kepada konsep kewujudan (karena kepada kemelekatan) yang dunawi (moha dan lobha).
umat berbicara tentang keBuddhaan, sesungguhnya mereka membicarakan kewujudan mereka.
bahkan kesunyaan yang dimaksud guru Buddha, dimaknai umat sebagai kosong dalam faham konsep kewujudan mereka meskipun secara teori mereka berteori berdebat-debat seolah-olah mereka mengenali tentang kebenaran yang guru Buddha maksud.
seperti juga penjelasan pada isi sutra diatas, bahwa guru Buddha membukakan kebenaran bahwa Ia mengajarkan konsep-konsep jalan umum kepada awam/murid-murid umum untuk supaya awam/murid  dapat membebaskan dari konsep kewujudan duniawi sehingga boleh dapat mengenali (keberadaan) yang sejati (the Truth). Tetapi bukan mengenali, malah-malah mereka terjebak kepada pandangan yang berasal dari ikatan kepada konsep kewujudan (karena kepada kemelekatan) yang dunawi diri mereka sendiri.
Itulah guru Buddha memberikan pengajaran jalan umum kepada awam, agar murid/umat dapat memisahkan yang duniawi, membedakan dan lalu sehingga mengenali kebenaran (keberadaan) yang sejati. sehingga dapat memaknai dengan benar meskipun belum merealisasi pembebasannya tentang tujuan kehidupan/pencapaian Nibanna (keberadaan kehidupan guru Buddha/mereka yang tercerahkan).
Itulah sehingga ada sebutan pengajaran jalan mulia (Mahayana) dan jalan umum. Tetapi kenyataan lagi adalah ada ajaran yang seolah-olah turunan mahayana tetapi terjebak lagi kepada takhayul yang melekat sesungguhnya kepada yang bersifat duniawi bukan jalan pembebasan seperti guru Buddha ajarkan yang sesungguhnya, karena kesalah pengenalan kebenaran dari ajaran mulia tersebut dari para murid/umatNya karena mereka terperangkap memaknai dalam kekhayalan manusia duniawi mereka sendiri juga (moha/kegelapan), dalam praktek keyakinan jalan pembebasan mereka bergantung kepada makhluk-makhluk aneh samsara, yang dimaksud guru Buddha tidak ada Tuhan 'dunia' yang dapat menyelamatkan. yang dimaknai salah juga oleh umat jalan umum sebagai tiada sumber kehidupan asaliah, melainkan semua hanya sebatas ukuran keberadaan duniawiah oleh karena terperangkap oleh konsep salah mereka sendiri (kebingungan atau kekacauan memaknai istilah kosong kekosongan yang mereka terjemahkan sendiri dari karena konsep (dari karena kemelkatan) kewujudan duniawi mereka sendiri).


nah omong-omong..klo penjelasan saya siapa yah sahabat umat yang ada dapat mengerti tulisan saya ini...? boro-boro mencerap, malah-malah menimbulkkan penolakan yang berasal dari ego keakuan (membangkitkan ego).

Itu saja saya hanya membicarakan, membagi kebenaran yang diajarkan oleh guru Buddha, apalagi klo saya membicarakan tentang Tuhan, the Almighty God. (Allah Bapa (Ex 3:14  And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you),    (Joh 10:9  I am the door: by me if any man enter in, he shall be saved, and shall go in and out, and find pasture. Joh 14:6   saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me) dan (diinsyafi) Roh kudus ( 26  But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you).
oleh karena ketidak-mengenalan sehingga seperti juga contoh ada umat yang memaknai malaikat Jibril dibilang sebagai Roh Kudus, padahal seperti yang sudah pernah saya jelaskan bahwa semua sudah ada tatanan, bahwa malaikat adlah sebagai malaikat fungsinya bukan lain.


sahabat buddhist
coecoed, the believer



coba amati batin sendiri, apakah itu terjadi pada anda atau tidak

nah omong-omong..klo penjelasan saya siapa yah sahabat umat yang ada dapat mengerti tulisan saya ini...?
« Last Edit: 27 September 2010, 12:10:36 PM by coecoed »
INILAH APA YANG TUHANKU TELAH KATAKAN, 'DALAM SATU TAHUN SEJAK HARI INI, KEJAYAAN MEREKA AKAN PUDAR'.


September 2010
coedabgf-the believer

 

anything