Phet-pin-aing Sayadaw puts questions to U Kavi at Abyarr village in Pegu (Bago) Township, on the 4th waning day of Kason (May) 1287ME.
(A Concise Record)
(Q). When eye and visual object come together does the eye go to the object, or does the object
go to the eye?
(A). Neither of them goes to each other, Venerable Sir.
(Q). Then how does the ‘seeing’ take place?
(A). By the functioning of the necessary faculty, the seeing is made possible, Venerable Sir.
(Q). If that's so, could we say the visual object goes to the eye?
(A). No, Venerable Sir, (Let me illustrate:) when you look at the sun, there is the bright
sunlight that causes the eye to wink with discomfort. The sun does not physically enter the
eye, nor does the eye enter the sun.
(Q). Well, now, tell me about Nibbāna.
(A). Venerable Sir! Lets say a Yogi on making Vipassanā practice considers Mind, Mental
Concomitants and Body as a great (cause of) suffering, and feeling disenchanted with
them, probes into the cause of suffering: he discerns that the cause is Tanhā (Craving).
As soon as he understands this Truth, the Path-Knowledge (Magga-Phala) abandons Tanhā
(Craving) and thereby the cause having been destroyed, the result does not come about.
Here, what had been taking place, involving arising and perishing, is Sannkhata. When
cause is destroyed and its effect is broken nothing (no rise and fall) takes place: this is
Asankhata, Nibbāna.
(Q). In that Nibbāna, are there shining objects like the sun or the moon or any bright lights?
(A). No, Venerable Sir.
(Q). If so, describe what Nibbāna look like?
(A). I can't describe it, Venerable Sir.
(Q). In that's case, there is no Nibbāna?
(A). Yes, Venerable Sir, Nibbāna does exist.
(Q). There are the four Ultimate Realities of Mind, Mental Concomitants, Body (Corporeality)
and Nibbāna, Isn't it so?
(A). That's right, Venerable Sir.
(Q). Tell me, what is Ultimate Reality?
(A). Venerable Sir! U Kavi has no words for Ultimate Reality. He has just to remain silent.
(Q). Well, well. Suppose someone were to call a block of gold, a piece of lead. Would that
gold turn into the lead?
(A). No, Venerable Sir, it wouldn't. However, Ultimate Reality (Paramatta) cannot be
demonstrated as with Conventional Truths (PaÒÒatta). When Mind and Body do not rise
and fall, when there is no more arising (Upādāna), momentary existing (®hiti) and
dissolution (Bhanga),(Upāda-®hiti-Bhanga) and there is a complete cessation, it is called
Nibbāna.
(Q). Tell me, how the ten stages of Insight (©ÈÓa) are developed?
(A). Let's say, a YogÊ practicing Ānāpāna, having gained concentration and keeps mindful of
bodily sensations. At first, he observes the sensation as perception. In time, he comes to
understand the arising and the dissolution of sensation in its real nature. Then he feels
dread and disgust about the nature of rising and falling in him.
(Q). The ten Insights are to be developed one by one? Is that not so?
(A). That is up to one’s choice, Venerable Sir.
(Q). How is it achieved without going one by one?
(A). By merely developing Sammasana nana, i.e. contemplating the three salient marks of
conditioned things, Insight is gained into rise and fall of phenomena followed by dread
and disgust about them. (Sayadaw intervenes here): "Well, wait a moment!, when you
contemplate the three marks of conditioned things (Sammasana nyana/Tilakhana knowledge), you understand rise
and fall of phenomena that is Udayabbaya nyana(Rise and fall knowledge) , you see the dissolution of phenomena
which is Bhanga nyana. You feel dread about it that is Bhaya nyana. You feel disgust about
it that is ĀdÊnava nyana. Yes that's correct, quite correct")
(Q). U Kavi, in the world, by conventional usage, there are Sotāpannas, Sakadāgāmis,
Anāgāmis and Arahantas, are there not?
(A). There are, Venerable Sir.
(Q). Do those Ariyās progress along the path stage by stage?
(A). No, Venerable Sir, they do not.
(Q). Then how do they progress? Would you tell me?
(A). Let's say, when a YogÊ has developed Insight into the nature of the rise and fall through
Sammasana-nyana and advanced the Knowledge through the ten stages of Insight
Knowledge, he is called by conventional usage, a SotÈpanna. Then he again cultivates the
ten Insight Knowledge and when he has done so, he is called a Sakadāgāmi. By advancing
this mode of cultivation of Insight for four times, he is called an Arahanta. (No further
record of these discussion made due to excessive references to Mundane usage).
Note: ada beberapa istilah memakai bahasa pali myanmar dan beberap sudah saya ganti ke bahasa pali yg kita kenal, tapi smoga tetap bisa menangkap arti sebenarnya. Tahapan2 dalam vipasana yg mencapai sotapanna-arahat terletak pada peninjauan ulang dari nyana2 yg ada. Silakan di baca mengenai nyana yg didapat melalui vipasanna di
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